NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

 

Home equity specialist Howard Tenn discusses the specific challenges note investors of every level encounters in the business. Expert note investors have difficulty finding inventory and capital. Those in the intermediate level start to get challenges like the experts but their experience is still not up to par, while newbies enter the business conflicted, confused, afraid to lose their money, and don’t know who to trust. Howard shares his honest opinion on why joint ventures aren’t sustainable for note investors. He also explains the advantages of lending money to note investors, what everyone needs to expect before making the commitment, and his lending philosophy.

Listen to the podcast here:

Note Investing Challenges And The Business Of Lending Money with Howard Tenn

Our guest here is Howard Tenn. What an honor to have you on. Thank you for joining us, Mr. Tenn. 

Thanks, Martin. 

You and I met at the California Distressed Expo. What a pleasure. You and I spent a lot of time together just getting to know each other and it was getting to know my wife as well, who was pregnant at the time. I definitely enjoyed the time that we spent together. 

Congratulations on the new addition. I was fortunate to see a posting of the child on Facebook, a beautiful kid. 

Thank you. I know that you’re a bit of a philosopher at heart. I enjoy the parable that you shared with my wife and meand I’m sure I’m going to screw it up, but it was something like when you’re looking at money, it’s like the shadow behind you. I’ll let you tell it. How about that? 

When you are going through life and you’re seeking to build your wealth, your money is like your shadow and the sun is the thing you believe in, your God, that you believe in your faith. Most people turn their back to the sun in pursuit of their wealth. They start chasing their shadow, but in doing that, the shadow keeps moving away from you. The key is to turn towards the sun and walk towards what you believe in. All the values, the family and your shadow will follow you. Wealth will follow you if you focus on what’s more important to you in life. That’s your God, your faith, your family. You should never forget that. 

Those are great words to live by. I know we’re going to get into how you help note investors, note investing companies thrive in nowadays market. Let’s start with some basic challenge issues that a lot of us are facing. My first question to you is what challenges do you find that the expert note investing companies have? What challenges do the midlevel players have? What challenges do the newbies have? 

The experts, their biggest challenge is really finding inventory and getting access to capital. They have systems in place. They know what they’re doing and they can handle whatever needs to be handled. The intermediate person, the learning curve is not as steep for him right now. He is starting to face similar challenges as the big boys deal flow. He wants to get tapes, but he’s still further down the rank. To get up to the higher levels, he not only doesn’t have the capital, but even if he had the capital, his systems are not strong enough to handle the bulk. The second tier guy, maybe he can handle four or five notes, but in order to get the big discounts, he may have to go up to fifteentwenty notes and he just doesn’t have to have the infrastructure to deal with that. 

The newbies, they’re all excited. They’ve heard all the stories. They’re all conflicted. They don’t know how to sort anything out. They are afraid to lose their money. They don’t know who to trust. They heard all the bad stories and they can tell you about the sister or the postman and they go back all the way down. Essentially, they regurgitate opinions versus advice. I always say the difference between opinion and advice. The opinion never gives you a solution. They will tell you the opinion, but it didn’t solve my problem. The advice, they tell you the opinion and inside that opinion is the solution to what you’re looking for. The newbies themselves have no background to really see what is true or what is not. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: People from real estate think of themselves as borrowers, while note investors think of themselves as lenders.

 

They’re reciting what sounds good essentially, what sounds right to their ears. What are some of the common opinions that you hear circulated around? 

The most dangerous one is this is something easy. The majority of the people in the note business comes from the real estate industry. They look at it and they approach it as if it was real estate. What they don’t seem to understand, it isn’t. In one of the presentations I did early this year at NoteWorthy, they relaunched that programThe first thing I ask and I see a show of hands of the number of people in here that are private lenders and two hands went up out of maybe 100 people. I was shocked to find that out because I say, “I have news for you. If you’re a note investor, you’re a private lender.” They think like borrowers. They don’t think like lenders. 

Is thinking like a borrower a reflection of their time in real estate? 

Yes, it’s a different mindset. think I’ve heard this from Eddie Speed. He said, “Some people make their living with a hammer and some people make their living with a pencil. When you become a note investor, you’re making your living with a pencil because you can’t just go down the house and hammer something up against the wall. It doesn’t work that way. A lot of times, the fixes require the instructions that would be done through a third party. If you’re into foreclosure, you can’t call up the guy and start arguing with him. Thats going to jeopardize your position. You’ve got to go through an attorney or go through loss mitigation team or something. That can be very frustrating because they feel like they’ve lost control. That’s what I notice a lot of times. 

The real estate investors are used to having physical control over the operation. 

Control is always an illusion. If you’ve got a tenant and those who have had real estate before and the tenant refuses to get out, he can tie you up just as bad. It can cause as much damage. Although they feel that they have control, it’s really an illusion. 

What’s the best mindset on the topic of newbies? What’s the best mindset for a newbie investor to come into the space with? 

The best mindset is to partner with someone. The problem is how do you partner with someone when the person you’re partnering, it’s not an even playing field. Most of the industry, in order to raise capital, is starting to getting in joint ventures. There are a lot of issues with joint ventures and we can get into that when you ask the question. Essentially, what a joint venture in its nutshell is, it goes like this. You put up the money and I’ll put up the knowledge and we’ll work together. At the end of the day, we will share in the rewards. I always say to someone, “What you’re telling me is I’m going to put up the money and you’re going to put up sweat equity.” The question is, when something goes wrong, who do you think is going to be doing the most sweating? 

It’s the passive investor. 

Wealth will follow you if you focus on what's more important to you in life. Click To Tweet

Because you do not have the knowledge of how to fix something, if the guy says, “Screw you, I’m out of here,” you’re now stuck because he has nothing to lose. I liken this to a contractor. A guy comes to your house and he says to you, “I’ll remodel your kitchen.” You go, “How much is it? He says, “$20,000. You say, Here’s $20,000.” Even if he’s a trusted guy, he might get distracted or he might need to be doing three projects at a time. You never get full control over it because he might be working on someone else. can tell you that anyone who is reading this, I’ve been in a joint venture. That is their biggest nightmare because they have no control over the guy who knows what to do and they don’t know what to do. One of the things I advocate as a private lender, the best way to learn the business is to be a private lender to someone. I structure a lot of deals in which it works out for both parties. Here’s the bottom line. If the guy with the knowledge doesn’t perform, you got recourse. hope I answered that question. 

What I get from you is that if you go into a joint venture with someone as the passive party, you should vet the expert, but there should also be some skin in the game from the experts. Moreover, the passive investor has a responsibility to get educated in the note industry and in the processes that take place in the workout phase. 

In the many years I’ve been doing this, I like to look at very complicated things and bring them down to very simple concepts. Because I have a computer background, I always say instead of dumping all the files on your desktop, put them in folders. Inside the folders, separate them into the three big issues. Prior to coming onto this, there was a guy called Bill. He asked me to Facebook friend him. I did. He had a post. I looked at that and I was watching him presenting and I thought, “Here’s a guy who knows how to communicate.” I was very impressed. I was watching his presentation versus the content, because I know what the contents are. I said, “This guy really knows how to present.” Not to make it sound like a paid endorsement.  

Someone like you who has written a book, it’s one thing to know what you’re doing. It’s a completely different mindset and skillset to be able to sit down and write a book because you have to go through all the details. You’ve got to go everything. Someone like you who has written a book, and I assume you wrote it yourself, it tells me that you not only are unconsciously competent in what you’ve done, you have the ability to think everything through consciously. I can tell you, the biggest skillset and mindset that you have to have in the note business is one of what I call a procedural mindset. You have to know what to do next and what you’re doing, how it affects the next two steps down the road. The ability to write a book told me volumes about you. I bought your book and I gave it away. I gave it away to people who give me money to lend out for them because by them understanding what you do, they feel confident to lend money to you. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: You got to have a strong stomach in dealing with the legal aspects of the note investing business.

 

That’s the one thing I always mentioned because I have people that approach me every week and they want to know about passive investment because they don’t have time. That’s the one thing I always lead them to. I’m like, “You really want to get some formal education, even if you’re going to be strictly passive because you want to know what the experts are doing with your money.” You want to know how to vet the expert and then you want to know what they’re doing with your money. At the end of the day, if something goes south, you as the passive investor are going to be the one sweaty. Let’s switch gears here, Mr. Tenn. I know that you have a lot of expertise with funds and raising capital and SEC rules and regulations. You saw the post that I had put out there and I know that you were definitely very involved in the comments. What are some steps you think that are important when a midlevel player starts a fund and is starting to raise capital? 

What I tell everybody is that you have to approach it with this mindset. The SEC takes the position that every investment is security. If you follow my logical steps. However, if you solicit for investments, you must have a license. I can tell your audience, a lot of their heads are exploding and disagreeing with me, but follow my line of thinking. The SEC allows you to operate without a license under certain exemptions and those exemptions that you have to follow in order not to violate SEC rules. As long as you follow the exemptions and the exemptions apply to what you’re doing, you cannot be in violation of those rules. 

What are those exemptions? There are so many different variations of that. Essentiallycertain things that the SEC would look for is are there any implied or promised forms of guarantee? Is the person that’s invested in, are they involved or are they so far out of it that the success is dependent on somebody outside of what they do? For instance, saying to someone, “You give me the money and I’ll look after everything and I’ll bring it. I’m not guaranteeing you anything, but I’ll bring back the profits.” Even though you said, I don’t guarantee anything, the person who is going to give you the money has a reasonable expectation that the money’s going to come back and something’s going to come back. 

You’re not in the exemptions right now. The one thing that I say to people, regardless of whether you think it is or it isn’t, the one thing you must do is keep the communications open. When I was in the securities field in the stock market, I took this stance. I want them to hear it from me first. Now, with the advent of texts and everything, you’ve got to respond as fast. You can’t hesitate. It is best to say, “We have a situation. Here is what it is. I’m working on it. I’ll follow up with you.” Keep the lines of communication open and be honest, be forthright. If something goes wrong, say to them it goes wrong. You did go wrong. At the end of the day, it’s the covering up and the lying and everything that is going to make the other person get upset. 

Switching gears on the same topic, what’s your thought when folks are commenting? Everyone wants to know about raising capital. Everyone wants to know more and have more education surrounding that. A few folks put on there that just by virtue of having a discussion on raising capital, that might be a violation of SEC rules and regulations. You commented on that specifically. Can you elaborate on your thoughts on that? 

If my memory serves me right, this wasn’t an open discussion. This was not us saying, “Here’s how you get around the laws. Here’s how you get around that. As I looked at the thread, I did not see anything in there that said we have a specific product and we are trying to raise money for this product. We’re just talking about the do’s and don’ts and opinions we’re being put out there. The last time I looked outside, I did see the American flag still flying, so I know I’m not going to be prosecuted for free speech because there was nothing being sold. There was no specific money being asked for. There were no guarantees being offered there. This was a free flow of ideas. In fact, part of the mere fact that someone brought up the thing that this could be a violation meant that we were cognizant of discussing to stay compliant. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: The SEC allows you to operate without a license under certain exemptions. It’s those exemptions that you have to follow in order not to violate SEC rules.

 

Our intentions were never to skirt the law. That’s why I chimed in and if you remember, I said I looked at everything. You’ve got to be careful when you go on these threats because now, I find people dig in and sometimes things get misinterpreted. My intention was not to offend someone but to encourage this ongoing dialogue. At the end of the day, you still have to seek legal advice if it’s something legal, what you call tax advice from the right people. Tgo back and add to the question about what are the biggest challenges newbies find is they’re trying to find a shortcut and they’re trying to find the most inexpensive way. They end up costing them money because in life, education is never free. You’re going to have to pay for that. 

I think it’s Robert Allen, the author. He says, “No thought is in your head rent-free.” There’s an expense to every thought you have going in your head. We have a lot of mid-level players in the group. What are their challenges and what can you say to that? 

Here is what I define as a mid-level player. They’re now at a point where their time becomes an issue for them. They want to scale up. They want to leave behind what they were doing. They like it and they’re trying to figure out, “How do I turn this into a career? Their biggest challenge is they have a source of income that’s coming in from another source and they have the income coming in from the note business. They have to make a decision, “Where do I spend most of my time?” The problem that they have is time issues more than anything else. They still got one leg on first base and they’re stretching trying to get the second base. You sometimes have to get off of first base in order to get the second base. The moment you get off first base, what happens is your income drops. That’s the philosopher in me, but I think people understand that. For them, what they have to start understanding now is they’re moving away from being a note investor to running a note business. It’s a different skill set because at some point, you might have to take on somebody to help you and now you’re responsible for that person’s livelihood. 

You need systems in place if you’re going to scale up and do it and be successful. Otherwise, you’ll be disorganized and you won’t be efficient with your time as you’re sourcing, vetting or working out.  

Time becomes the mid-level person’s biggest issue. He will still have deal flow as an issue and raising capital as an issue, but his biggest issue becomes time because he just doesn’t have as much time. In fact, I think I saw a comment on someone about time blocking. The reason you are doing this, Martin, and the reason most people are doing this are they want their time back. If you are the biggest note guy out there, you’ve got all the access to the deal, all the access to the money and you have no time for your children. Are you successful? 

It depends on how you define it. It’s relative but to me, you’re not. I’m far from the biggest note guy, but I have a nice balance in life. I’m looking for time, not money. 

I often tell people, “Would you like to earn $1 billion? They said yes. If you could figure out how to give Bill Gates eight hours more in a week, he not only will give you $1 billion for it, he’ll lead you to some of his friends. That was one of the reasons why I saw the situation and went to the private lending side and lend you guys money because I am able to get a part of the income, very passive and extremely secure. That is why I did what I did because I know over a long period of time, I am going to do just as well as anybody else. I’m going to enjoy the ride because my stress levels are not there. 

Someone call you legally insane, Howard, because who lends on note portfolios, nonperforming note portfolios at that. You hear about portfolio lending on the performing note side but on the nonperforming note side. Tell us what type of expertise you have to have for that or how do you avoid risk in that? 

There were three major questions in that. The first one is you’ll see that at the end of my bio, “Never bet on the horse, bet on the jockey. The person who made the comment is looking at the horse, the horse or the nonperforming notes. The jockey is the person who I’m about to lend them money to buy that nonperforming note, to make this relevant so people could understand it. In the hard money lending space, it is very often someone will come and say, I have tied up a house and afterrepair value is let’s say $100,000. In order for me to buy it, I need $30,000 and I’m going to put another $35,000 in it. I ought to sell it at $100,000. There are hundreds of people who will lend money on that. How is that any different than a nonperforming note? Think about it. There’s absolutely no difference. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: Americans are the most genuine, generous and wonderful people, but they’re also their own worst enemy.

 

The thought is that the conversion of the nonperforming note is what’s going to pay you back. That’s the thought. 

I think they’re looking at the quality of the collateral. What is the quality of the collateral? There are many different ways in which I will do this. One of the things is I could say, “You’re going to buy this for $30,000. I tell you what you do. You put in $10,000 and I’ll lend you $20,000. Once you get control of the asset and you are able to determine your workout strategy and everything, you come back to me and everything is a lot clearer. I will say, “Here’s your $10,000 now. One of the things I learned about notes is that their value changes over time depending on what you’ve done with them. They fluctuate so they often have different values at all times. 

Not just what you’ve done with them, a lot of people look and talk about the note price increases as of late, but what a lot of people don’t talk about is that there’s been a lot of equity spikes across the country. The equity back in those notes has increased as well which will naturally increase the price.  

Not only that, the due diligence that has gone through some of these files as they change hands have also added value to those notes. Few people know that, but I was able to ascertain that. For instance, a note that has changed hands three times, that complete chain of command intact, is far more valuable than a note that has changed hands twice but not properly a chain of command intact. Don’t get me wrong. Don’t think that I don’t know how to do the note business. I know how to do the note business and that’s why I’m comfortable lending to it. The reason why hard money lenders will not lend to it is that they don’t understand the business. 

The service that you provide for someone, I would assume that you’re looking for that mid-level player to expert player to larger-scale player to lend to. 

I’ll tell you one of the things that over the last year that I have decided. I am 60 years old and I look and I say, “What are the important things in my life?” I look at the note industry and we’re playing with people’s lives at the end of all of that. Part of what I want to know is what the purpose of your business is. Not just I want to make money, I want to throw that guy out, I want to take the house, look at this. A lot of people come to me with that and I said, “I don’t play that.” I think I can best sum this up. If you understand this, you will understand what ultimately tips that decision in my favor. 

In 2018, I was at a real estate meetup and I met a guy for the first time. He was there and he wanted to buy a mobile home and fix it up. He couldn’t get the financing. I asked him, “What’s your story? He said he used to do fix and flips, divide lands and everything. He is a guy who knows what he is doing. He had a son and a two-year-old. The son came down with leukemia and he shelters operation down, moved from Minnesota to California. Now the son is okay and he’s looking to get back into the business. I went on to my wife and said, “We’re going to land on a mobile home.” She said, “We don’t know how to secure it. I said, I know, we’re going to figure it out. 

The borrower always gets the best deal because they get cash and the lender gets a piece of paper. Click To Tweet

She said, “Why?” I said, “We need to give a two-yearold boy his father back.” We loaned it and we successfully got it done. We helped him and he made a lot of money. This is a pre-1979 mobile home, which means that the person who’s going to buy cannot get FHA financing. We helped him. We taught him how to do seller financing. We helped him all the way through that. Did I make a lot of money on that? No. Did I give him back? Yes. He’s coming back again and we’re going to help him. To me, that’s what I look for. A section of my money goes to those people. I do work with newbies who really are trying to improve their lives. 

We work with the other people, the midlevel trying to get them to move ahead. One of the things I hate being associated with is with a hard money lender. One of the things hard money lenders do when the loan comes due and you can’t pay the interest rate goes through the roof. A few months ago, I spoke with my wife and I said, “Is there a way we can do it so that we don’t have to invoke that clause?” Now, every loan that we put in place, there is no escalation of the interest rate. What we might do is amortize the loan so you have to pay it back faster. The reason being is if I escalate the writ, your payments are going to go up anyway, but the loan is never getting paid off and you get upset with me. I said, “That’s not what we lend the money for. We’re not lending the money for that. We’re lending the money so you can pursue your dreams and go the direction you want to go. If I develop that relationship with my borrower, imagine the jockeys I’m now betting on. There’s almost no risk. That’s what we try to develop. That’s really my philosophy. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: You cannot put a price on having the ideal work-life balance.

 

What’s your sweet spot? What’s your sweet range that you like to lend to for note tapes? 

I would say up to $100,000, but when you say a sweet spot, we’re really looking at the person’s capability. If someone came to me and said, “I want to buy this tape.” The first thing I ask is how many notes are there? I said, “Tell me your experience in dealing with that amount of notes before.” You see this all the time. People buy the tapes and then somewhere along the line they’re selling off the notes and get to them. That to me is like somebody who is greedy unless the strategy is to sell off the notes. 

If you do a large takedown and you have some notes that are outside your parameters so you don’t have a comfort level, then you offload that way. If you’re offloading a good amount because you don’t have a capacity to work them, that’s a jockey issue. 

I don’t have a problem with people like that, but I want to know, “Are you operating in your core competency? Has pride entered into your calculus and you do not see it? I’m very good at figuring those things out because I can tellI come out of the securities industry and I don’t care if you could be angel Gabriel, you go in that industry and you’ll come out Lucifer. I was making ten times my wife and we had to make the decision, “Is she going to leave her job and come back to Canada to live? I decided I would give it up because I wanted a family. 

What converts somebody into doing unscrupulous activities? 

lot of times they miscalculateIt’s because they miscalculate, I don’t believe in walking away from them because we all make mistakes. The bottom line is if you can remind them, “Here’s what you’re trying to do. In other words, we’re in this industry because the lending institution did not take the time to say to the person, “You really shouldn’t be doing this. When the excrement hit the fan, the defense was you know what you are signing. I am sure you’ve seen homeowners that were lawyers, judges that fell into that situation. The essence of Dodd-Frank as it applies to you on us is that they have essentially said if this is not an even situation, you the lender is in a stronger position than their person. 

It’s like an adult to a child. Here’s what we’re going to do. We’re going to put their onus on you, the lender, to make certain that the loan can perform and they have the ability to repay. We’re not going to say you have to guarantee it. We’re just going to say you have to make certain and with certain disclosure that you can do this. One of the lookback periods is they make certain you have a three-year lookback period. For those who don’t know, when I look at that and when I hear everything, I said, “Isn’t that what the fairness doctrine is all about? Knowing that when I am lending money, I want to make certain they understand that you’ve got a gun here. You are accustomed to using a certain sized gun, but now you want me to help you get a machine gun, which you’ve never fired before. Do you really know what you’re doing? Do you have the systems in place? What I don’t want to do is finance your destruction. 

For those of you who don’t know, Howard, you’ve read DoddFrank front and back. 

In fact, I am rereading the section the ability to pay and seller financing. I constantly reread them. 

In life, education is never free. You’re going to have to pay for it one way or another. Click To Tweet

I think along those lines is constant education. A lot of folks that have been in this space have survived because they have continued their education in this space and it’s a requirement. Note investing is not something you can just learn the basics upfront and then you’re good to go. It’s ongoing. 

Let me share with you a piece of information that comes to mind. First of all, I subscribed to two blogs that are run by attorneys who fight the note investors. By being in the blog, I know exactly their mindset. I know what’s happening. The moment you issue a foreclosure on a property, it’s a public document. Those lawyers are monitoring the public site. The moment that happens, that homeowner is going to get a barrage of mail telling them how to screw you over. Understand when you buy a note, you better have capital in reserve for in order to fight this fight. In getting emotional about it, you’re going to lose. What happens is you will often see notes that have gone as close to foreclosure and pull back, go to foreclosure and pull back. The reason they pullback is not because of anything other than the note holder did not have the stomach to go beyond that. They never told this. You talked to most of them and they mostly go in there because they really want to keep the person in their home. The bottom line is if the guy says, I’m not going to pay you and I can get a couple more years of doing this. Why do I have to listen to you? You’ve got to get off of that and understand what you’re dealing with. 

There is that side. You have to have a strong stomach in this business. There is a legal aspect to this business and that’s your leverage in most cases. 

About 20% to 25% of nonperforming notes that are sitting there doing absolutely nothing is sitting at servicing companies because it’s a person who bought it. I have no more capital and do not have the stomach to take it any further. It just sits there. 

It doesn’t just sit there, it sits there and is collecting revenue for the servicing company. When I do my workshops, I always tell everyone, Everyone overlooks the vendors at the conferences and within the note industry in general, but they can be a very strong source for business. Howard, you also do some training of sorts. What’s the training program that you focus on? 

What we offer is we train people how to become a private lender, specifically using their IRAs. What we do is teach people how we land to the note business. The person who says, “You’ve got to be crazy to do that. He is correct. That is the barrier. No one has ever taken the time to figure out how you solve that problem. It took me a year to solve the problem. I took risks, but I never lost money and I did it with people that are of your caliber. I knew I wasn’t taking any risk. The bottom line is every deal is not the same. Essentially, I’m doing the same thing to you. 

The only difference is I am replacing you with the homeowner because I am lending to an entity. Dodd-Frank doesn’t apply to me. My biggest risk is the same biggest risk that you have. That is foreclosure. When you foreclose against the homeowner, you’ve got to spend a lot of this money. When I foreclosed against you, I now move from a commercial loan to consumer loan and the rules change. What I teach people is you don’t want to be that. What you have to do is underwrite the lending process. What we teach is all of that. What essentially I teach people to do is how to understand the risk, what I call risk to return ratio. 

If I said to someone, “Would you like 8% with three units of risk or 20% with thirteen units of risk? Which one would you prefer? You come to realize itThe question is how do you measure that? We teach them that. When Tiger Woods was the dominant force, they ask him, “What is your mindset? He saidI played the hole from the green coming back to the fairway.” He looks at the green and he said, “What iron do I want to have shooting into the green? He subtracts the length. He says, “What’s the safest way to get to that spot?” He may never use his driver. In the loan, when we open up the coaching session, we go, “Here is what you have to assume. On the first day, you lend the money. On the second day, the guy defaults. On the third day, you own the asset. What are you going to do? Before you wait until that happens, let’s look at what happens if you own the asset. 

NIME 17 | Note Investing Challenges

Note Investing Challenges: Know why the borrower is asking you for money and if they have the capability and experience to be able to exit.

 

It’s strategy. Once you figure that out, the next thing you ask, “If the guy doesn’t pay me, how quickly and with the least amount of expense can I take full control of that? On the first days, who am I giving this money to?” I always tell people at the time of closing, the borrower gets the best deal because he gets cash and you get a piece of paper. Once I set their minds in that mindset, everything reveals. Once they come there, all of a sudden everything opens up and they realize, “You’re doing the note business. You’re just dealing with a different borrower.” The bottom line is this is something in a nutshell. If anyone’s interested, here’s how we teach it. I can tell you how to ride a bicycle. I can tell you how to ride a horse. Unless you get up on the horse and unless you get up on the bicycle, you will never learn. What I tell people is if you are interested, we charge a nominal fee, but you have to come with money to lend.  

If you have someone who would be willing to lend you moneythey’ll lend you the money. They lend it to somebody that they know and we paper it and we show them how you paper the whole thing. Do you know what the nice part about this is? Unlike any other real estate courses that you buy, you get your money back, you make money while you’re learning versus you plunk down $25,000 and you need to take the next few years trying to recover that cost. The only thing you gave up is that one year of thinking you could have made 20%, which is really not there. 

I really thank you for your time. 

Martin, I appreciate you reaching out to me. I admire you. I get a lot of pleasure watching the posting with your family. Say hello to your wife for me. 

I will. 

Perhaps the next time we’ll see each other is at the California Distressed Mortgage Expo. If you go to any conferences before then please let me know. I like to spend some quality time as we did in 2018. I really enjoyed that. 

In a joint venture, be honest and always keep the lines of communication open. Click To Tweet

We definitely do. To the people reading, thank you very much for your time. I hope I was able to add value to the time you spent and I look forward to that. I would prefer that if you friend request, then I will share my information that way versus putting it out there in public. 

Don’t worry about offending somebody. I posted a very funny video about insurance premiums going up. It was nonpolitical, but I offended 100 people as I put up a funny video. Whatever you do, you’re going to offend somebody. 

It still does not give you a pass to say I’m sorry. I love this country as an immigrant. It saddens me to see they’re fighting, but my dad does say to me, Americans are the most generous and wonderful people, but they’re also their own worst enemy. Unfortunately, I’m seeing that happening and I’m hoping that somehow, we come to our senses before we become a third world country. 

We’ll save that for conference discussion, Howard. Thank you for joining us. Take care and God bless. 

 

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About Howard Tenn

NIME 17 | Note Investing ChallengesFinancial Planners, CPA, Wealth Management Advisors, Long Term Care agents, and Trust & Estate Professionals, get more business by attracting underserved clients away from other financial professionals. I can help you target and attract Clients that will open an account with you.

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